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This Challenge invites you to design a portable trailer that could be used to take the Catfish race car to and from the track, while also being small and light enough to fit into a single car garage.
Catfish is a custom sports car designed for race tracks. This car is intended for track days and endurance racing. It's also minimalist, and this Challenge invites you to create a minimalist portable car trailer for the Catfish that show "out of the box" thinking.
Two wheels only -- for easy trailer movement when not connected to the car
No-ramp trailer gets extra points. This means that the trailer floor could act as the ramp, or could be lowered flat to allow the very low Catfish to drive on and drive off
Single car garage storage. The trailer must store in a single garage. The tongue and/or wheels may release from the main platform
The trailer floor may be open or solid...lightness is preferred
The general dimensions of the car are 146" long, 68" wide, 90" wheelbase, and should allow for a 1,700lb car
The competition is open to everyone. Multiple entries are acceptable. Team entries are welcome - prize will be transferred to team leader.
Tag your entry with “catfish” when uploading to GrabCAD. If you submit through the "Submit entry" button, this should be added automatically. Only entries with valid tag will participate. Only entries uploaded to GrabCAD through the "Submit entry" button on this Challenge page will be considered an entry.
The winning designs become the intellectual property (IP) of the Challenge sponsor.
By entering this competition, you 1. Warrant that the work is your original work. 2. To the best of your knowledge, it is not, and has not been in production or otherwise previously published or exhibited. 3. Neither the work nor its use infringes the intellectual property rights (whether a patent, utility model, functional design right, aesthetic design right, trade mark, copyright or any other intellectual property right) of any other person.
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If you think an entry may infringe on existing copyrighted materials, please email challenges@grabcad.com.
Applicants are not entitled to any compensation or reimbursement for any costs. The applicant’s participation shall not constitute employment, assignment or offer of employment or assignment.
The sum of the Awards is the total gross amount of the reward. The awarded participant is solely liable for the payment of all taxes, duties and other similar measures if imposed on the reward pursuant to the legislation of the country of his/her residence, domicile, citizenship, workplace, or any other criterion of similar nature.
Winning designs will be chosen based on the rules and requirements. This Challenge starts on September 2, 2013 and ends on October 2, 2013 (11:59pm UTC). Winner will be announced by November 2, 2013.
We will release the winners before the final announcement to give the Community an opportunity to "vote" for their favorites in the comments. The jury will take these into consideration when picking the final winner. This new addition is based on feedback from you!
The sum of the Awards is the total gross amount of the reward. The awarded participant is solely liable for the payment of all taxes, duties and other similar measures if imposed on the reward pursuant to the legislation of the country of his/her residence, domicile, citizenship, workplace, or any other criterion of similar nature.
Only public entries will be considered. Any private submissions will be made public at the Challenge deadline.
$2,500 cash for the winning design + GrabCAD notebook and sports bottle
Catfish shirts
The judges for the competition include Cord Bauer, Ron Hemphill, Mark Blakey and David Beckett from Bent Motorsports and David Green from DG Motorsports.
Bauer Limited Production's goal is to produce hand-crafted, light weight sports cars. The Catfish is the embodiment of our goals. It's a retro-mod sports car that is extremely light weight and can carry a number of different drivetrain packages, from a simply Miata inline 4 to the latest 500+ horsepower Chevy LS engine. The frame is exceedingly stout and it's natural habitat is at track days, autocross or wheel to wheel competition.
More info: www.bauerltd.com
Kaspar Kiis
Cord Bauer
Ron Hemphil
David Beckett
Dave Green
Mark Blakey
ShawnHave an awesome idea for this competition? Want to win cool prizes? Sign-up now to upload your entries.
If you don't receive the email within an hour (and you've checked your Spam folder), email us as confirmation@grabcad.com.
136 comments
Tim Titus over 11 years ago
Sweet!!! Sounds like a great challenge. I am looking forward to the requirements and more details!
Tim Titus over 11 years ago
1st Question:
what is the car's exact height for the following:
1. The highest point of the hood
2. The top of the windshield
3. The top of the rollbars
4. The highest point of the trunk
2nd Question:
How much clearance are you looking for on the sides, front and back?
3rd Question:
Out of the following two, which will be weighed more heavily during judging?:
1. Lower manufacturing cost
2. Better looking / innovative design
Cheers!
Tim Titus over 11 years ago
4th question:
Is an open or enclosed trailer design preferred?
Tan Wei Kok over 11 years ago
We don't have garage in our home here except the filthy rich. So how big exactly is a single car garage. A simplified CAD file of Catfish would be nice, else we will replace it with a Ferrari/Porsche during rendering. Thanks >)
Marty Williams over 11 years ago
Going "single axle" (only two wheels) has serious safety and performance concerns when towing a car, even if it is only 1700 lbs. Not to mention it is illegal in some states, limiting the market. Could a tandem setup be considered, providing it easily converts into a single for manuvering by hand?
Sebob over 11 years ago
Very nice Sport caR !
RickyMon over 11 years ago
GrabACad Notebook as in Laptop? or paper notebok?
Петар Трлајић over 11 years ago
I think that for this and all chhalanges, sponsor should draw some sketch with deffault values-dimensions, like Scarbs F1, man who made site for explaining f1 technical rules and drawing skecthes for any new rule.
simon over 11 years ago
could you please tell me the ground clearance of the car also what size do you call a single garage here in Ireland its 16' by 10' by 8' not sure if its the same in america
Alain Di Zeo over 11 years ago
What will be the crteria for judging each design? For example, will weight be a top priority, use of standard materials for cost, ease of use, etc... and what priority will each criteria have.
Next question, will you include the typical loadings that we are designing for, or are we expected to determine the loads ourselves based on the car's weight and assumptions of a normal driving style?
Finally, what format(s) will be acceptable for the submission of the CAD models, along with what info do you want us to provide (weight, etc...) and do you require a rendering and/of will a rendering improve the score at all?
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
And we're off! Good questions. LOTS of questions. One reason for coming to GrabCAD for this challenge is the absolute wealth of international talent, which means that a challenge is considered from many points of view...not just American. As such, we don't want to lead the design process too finely, as we don't want to stifle the talent and ingenuity of the GrabCAD community.
The Catfish was made with the general principle that if it did not make the car go, stop or turn, it doesn't belong on the car. The trailer challenge follows that spirit. Therefore, while we'll accept a four wheel trailer concept, consider that you're being judged by a group of people who felt that car doors were not a necessity. :) In short, if you want an insight as to our judging priorities, look at our car.
A typical single car garage in the U.S. has an opening that's 8 feet wide by 7 feet tall. This is tight--a 68" wide car and an 84" opening. The garage depth is usually 18 feet, before assorted boxes and a hobby table are added. The Catfish is designed for weekend competition, and a trailer that does not take a car's worth of space potentially means that more people could enjoy the option of owning a track-only car. Consider also if the open deck separated from the wheels and tongue; the car could be left at a working level for easier maintenance in the garage, and adjustments at the track. The trailer structure could potentially simply lean against the garage wall.
The Catfish is based on the Mazda Miata. As such, thousands of Spec Miata racers all over the world may have interest in this type of trailer. And Porsche enthusiasts. And BMW.
For the best review of vehicle specifications (in metric as well), visit the Wikipedia site for the Mazda Miata. The Catfish is approximately 2" wider, and carries wheel widths up to 10". Our default software is SolidWorks, but we would be very interested in taking advantage of GrabCAD's new Workbench. Any format that can be viewed in Workbench will be allowed.
Alain Di Zeo over 11 years ago
Cord Bauer, you said that Solidworks is the default software. Will you accept Solidworks 2013 format?
Scott Frash over 11 years ago
What is the price range for the finished product? Are you looking for low cost and functional, or slick and cool to match the car with cost is no issue?
Also, you have garage dimensions?
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
SW 2013 is acceptable. Our car is priced at $13,900, and the prototype racer regularly beats cars costing 3-4 times its build cost. People should not have to pay a premium for intelligent design.
bj over 11 years ago
I made a private entry with an idea I would only like to share with the challenge sponsor at this time. Is that okay? Will they be able to see the entry? I dont see collaborators in the linked workbench..
Jakov Vrbanec over 11 years ago
Cord Bauer, you said ''thousands of Spec Miata racers all over the world may have interest in this type of trailer''. Does that mean that this trailer is universal and do I must consider other dimensions of example porsche?? And if this is challenge for design, could trailer include some type of aerodynamic shape or just skeleton (constructive) shape?
Jakov Vrbanec over 11 years ago
And also what type of tires would be fitted on trailer?
Rafael Acosta over 11 years ago
1 question. What is dimensions of the catfish's wheels? more specifically the width.
Thanks
Alain Di Zeo over 11 years ago
Is there a way to submit my entry without it being available for everyone to see and download. I mean I only want the jury and Cord Bauer to have access my design, if possible (just to make sure no one else takes ideas from my design).
Tim Titus over 11 years ago
You can set it as "private" when you submit the model. Alot of the challenges don't accept private entries (I don't see that it is a requirement to submit only public entries for this challenge), however even if it is, you can then change you design to public before the deadline.
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
Catfish are designed for 17 x 9 rims, 245/35-17 tires. This is a 23.8" diameter tire with an overall width of 9.7".
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
Alain, private entries are allowed.
Alain Di Zeo over 11 years ago
Thank you Tim Titus for explaining to me how to submit private entries and Cord Bauer for allowing the submission of private entries.
lefteris over 11 years ago
fantastic project,i'm interested a lot with this.
Do you want closed or open trailer?
Can you provide more dimensions like from the wheel until the front or the back of the car or the height of the car?
Thank you in advance.
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
The challenge was made with an open trailer in mind. When considering dimensions, the best starting point is the Mazda Miata. Then factor in a racing suspension setup (lowered) and most likely the use of a front splitter (longer in front).
Tim Titus over 11 years ago
Without a model its impossible to project what the load angle must be in order for the catfish to not hit the loading deck. Please let us know what the max loading angle can be. 5% grade? 15% grade?
I guess you are hoping we come up with some kind of incredibly innovative design that will be cheap to make, will load at any angle, doesn't have separate ramps, and also doesn't copy any existing designs in the market. If we were to come up with something as innovative as that, it would be quite stupid to hand it over to a company for $2500 and never see another penny from our design.
So the only possible result of this challenge is a remix of existing technologies that achieves the loading angle and the weight requirements while still being cheap to manufacture. I see only one design solution that does all those things, and it's just a matter of time until all the other designers figure that out and then tell you what you probably already know.
Oh well, Ill give it a shot I guess.
Tan Wei Kok over 11 years ago
@Tim Maybe you want to look at mazda mx5 concept style. I am using it as a base since Catfish is based on it =)
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
Tim: after the wheel was invented, the trailer (ox cart, wagon, chariot) soon followed. In dreaming up this challenge, our team came up with no less than four designs that are not in use now, two of which have no ramp angle. The Catfish has a trailer now, and we don't NEED another one. This is a "what if" challenge, where thinking outside the normal parameters may yield a new and innovative design for something that's been around for thousands of years. This ain't about the money...it's about making a better design for the thing that was probably attached to the first wheel, shortly after it was invented. :)
Tim Titus over 11 years ago
Thanks for the response Cord. I was just a bit taken aback after looking at the requirements page and seeing that anything we make will become property of your company.
I wish you would have stated that you already had a trailer design and simply wanted a new innovative method for loading / unloading a car, within specific trailer dimensions. This would have saved myself and others quite a lot of time up till now.
And, I want to clarify that I did not mean there is no reinventing the wheel. The wheel can always be reinvented. I was just saying that reinventing the wheel on a budget is something totally different, and much more difficult, especially when you are dealing with something that is on a larger scale such as a trailer.
Cheers
Tim Titus over 11 years ago
@Tan Wei Kok, thanks for the Mazda Mx5 link. Good thinking!
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
Tim, we have a trailer, not a trailer design. It's a standard trailer that takes up too much space and looks like every other trailer you can buy. Wouldn't it be nice if someone designed a trailer that fit in a single car garage?
mohamed khan over 11 years ago
i must say , the idea of having no ramp ,cool. why did i not think of that.
Russell White over 11 years ago
What specifications of the Catfish are available? Frame type? Wheel base length and width? Tare weight?
thank you
Russell White over 11 years ago
Disregard the questions about weight, length and width...I find reading to be good. :)
Luciano A. over 11 years ago
What is the distribution of weight per wheel?
The trailer should have a weight limit?
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
Conventional trailer axles have a typical weight rating of 3,500lbs, and I'm going to 'assume' that there is a safety factor built into those axles. The vehicle weight is 1,550lbs - 1,700lbs.
hohamo over 11 years ago
What is the biggest angle of the ramp , before spoiler hits the ramp ?
Any dims will be appretiated .
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
The ramp angle needs to be as low as 10 degrees for a race setup. A normal angle may be 12-15 degrees. Racers are fairly crafty about putting their cars up on trailers, and can turn a 15 degree angle into something that would work for a 10 degree race car. But avoiding the "trailer dance" is the goal. All the cars driven professionally are lowered via a flat platform. Road race, that is.
Michael over 11 years ago
What is the track length of the tires?
Michael over 11 years ago
Also, what is the distance from the front wheel to the nose of the vehicle and the rear wheel to the back?
Russell White over 11 years ago
What is the axle weight ratio of the Catfish front axle versus rear axle?
What is the minimum ground clearance?
What is the official tire size of the Catfish?
When stated the trailer must store in a single car garage, does that mean trailer with mounted Catfish or trailer empty?
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
Hi Russell, some of your answers are in the replies to this challenge. The car has a 50/50 weight bias. Here's a secret from trailer manufacturers: for every foot of overall trailer length,the trailer axle is placed 1" behind the center line of the platform. This prevents the trailer from "wandering" when towed. The rest I will leave up to your discretion.
Russell White over 11 years ago
Is there a 3d mesh of the Catfish available? or maybe 2d multiviews?
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
No, but I believe that there are several Miata views available in Sketchup and other sources. That would be the default size.
Simonr over 11 years ago
I used to have a trailer I built for an off road buggy which lifted the vehicle by the frame / jacking points rather than the wheels. This was an advantage as it could be used to remove wheels / aid repairs in the field. It also dismantled to fit in the trunk of the tow vehicle. Would a solution like this be acceptible? If so, do you have the locations of the jacking points & clearance under the vehicle?
bj over 11 years ago
Did some googling and ended up with the term "tow dolly" which seems to me ideal for what you are looking for..?
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
Simonr, lifting by the jacking points is definitely out of the box thinking. The main tube frame runs between the wheels at 52" wide, center on center. Height is variable, with a minimum height being approximately 4".
Simonr over 11 years ago
Thanks Cord - I have a plan! My off-roader had 22" under the frame - but 4" is possible!
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
Cars break or crash at track events all the time. While the odds are much better you'll make it home driving to and from an autocross event or even a track day, competitive racing requires a trailer.
Mechanical Engineering over 11 years ago
an help to design: Mazda MX5 - body for Bauer challenge
Simonr over 11 years ago
You don't push the car as hard in an event if in the back of your mind, you know it has to be in good condition to drive home in! We all used to drive to & from events, but as the sport has become tougher and people are more worried about driving on the road in a vehicle which may have developed faults during competition - now everyone trailers their vehicles!
Surya Mohan Tyagi over 11 years ago
Pls give the dimensions in metric system....
Aimo over 11 years ago
There are found in Marco Cerrato's link.
vijay singh over 11 years ago
what is the judjing criterea ??
Mechanical Engineering over 11 years ago
put in Grabcad or choose the standard components (wheels, brakes, tag, lights, etc.) to start from a common base.
Simonr over 11 years ago
In the link http://grabcad.com/library/mazda-mx5-concept-stylv that Tan posted above, the car (in Solidworks 2013) appears to be about 2:1 scale. It may not matter - but if you use it as a guide to dimensions, you may end up with a toy sized trailer!
Anthony Michael over 11 years ago
Hi, Is the car front or rear wheel drive?
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
This is amazing...twelve entries and twelve completely different approaches to the challenge. And we still have 30 days left! GrabCAD never ceases to amaze. Thanks to all who have entered so far...
Farzin Raafat over 11 years ago
what is the dimensions of the wheel you want to be used for the trailer,the ring dimension,and the Tire dimension?
and what specification for the material and metal you want to be used for trailer frame?
Jonathan Mullis over 11 years ago
what is the ground clearance of the car, and what are the dimensions of a single garage as different countries have different building codes
Simonr over 11 years ago
The recommended minimum size for a single garage in Europe is 2.9m wide by 5m long which will contain 95% of cars sold (though not big enough for my Land Rover!). However, the standard door opening is only 7' or 2.13m wide.
On the basis that EU vehicles tend on the whole to be smaller than US ones, this might be a reasonable size to base the design on.
I have a Brian James Transporter trailer which is just big enough most UK cars and is 2.4m wide by 6.5m long - thus it would not fit!
I would therefore say that the max size should be 2.1m x 4.9m which only allows 50mm / 2" all around - so you better practice your trailer reversing!
Simonr over 11 years ago
Also - the trailer draw bar needs to be long enough to make turns. In general a 45 degree turn is allowed for, which requires the draw bar to clear the front of the trailer by about 1/2 the total width of the tow vehicle - or about 1m. Thus the trailer length should be the length of the Catfish + 1m minimum.
jesse over 11 years ago
i have a question is there standard trailer parts to use axle hubs wheels ect? can i download these parts somewhere or do i have to draw them myself? also whats the go with using hydraulic system yes no? is that cost effective? does this have to be a full on model or are you more interested in the concept?
Simonr over 11 years ago
Just read that the car is 68" wide - so the wheels on the trailer need to stick out less than 8"/200mm on either side to fit a standard garage door.
Gert Skatškov over 11 years ago
Same question as jesse asked: are you looking more for concept or production ready CAD?
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
There are benefits and detractors to using existing trailer parts. While it would certainly be easier and less expensive to re-purpose existing parts, I think that the main functions we're looking for will require the design of new at least a few new parts.
Our intention is to produce the winning trailer concept for use with the Catfish. We will probably change the design to suit our specific needs, so a strong concept can conceivably win the challenge.
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
My posit was that shortly after the wheel was invented, the trailer soon followed. I see much more creativity with this trailer challenge than was ever given to the wheel. The levering, angling and screw and gear mechanisms used to meet the design criteria are all unique solutions applied to an age-old product.
Farzin Raafat over 11 years ago
hey guys any idea about wheel dimensions standard?
and is aluminume the appropriate material for the frame?
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
Standard rim sizes for safe highway travel are 15" x 6" rim. Tire diameters average 27"-28"; 688mm for 205/75-15 tire.
david over 11 years ago
hi cord bauer.
i have a question?
How important is AESTHETICS on the trailer design ?
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
David, the aesthetics of this challenge come from the elegance of the solution. Form follows function, in other words.
Donald Wilson over 11 years ago
Cord, you said that the typical single car garage opening is 8' wide by 7' tall, but then said that the opening is 84 inches. Which one do we build to? I believe your 8' (96") dimension is correct.
(As a side note, many single car garages now are being built with a 9' wide door.)
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
Hi Donald, the 8' (96") dimension is for doors. Sorry, the 84" dimension is my mistake. While I'd love a 9' wide door, I think that Euro doors may even be narrower. I"m going to guess that any design that can fit a 9' wide door can be adapted to an 8' opening. If so, design per your requirements.
Simonr over 11 years ago
@Cord - as you suspected, doors in the UK are often 7' wide. My double door is 15' and considered big. However, my Land Rover Defender, while huge by UK standards, is tiny in US terms! It would probably fit in the back of an F450!
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
20 days left and over 325 various trailer design downloads...
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
Simonr - does that mean those Brit garages won't fit my LR3? :)
Simonr over 11 years ago
@Cord - No! They will fit width wise, but it's tight. The height is the problem. If you lower the suspension (access mode) it might just! I like D3's (as we call them!)!
thinkin3D over 11 years ago
Where do we get center of gravity info, how much tongue weight, catfish model, and prefeerd methods of fabrication/materials?
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
thinkin3d--only size and load requirements have been noted. manufacturability will definitely be taken into consideration.
Ioannis Skarlatakis over 11 years ago
Hi, Guys I am posting this as I want to be honest with you... I checked the Youtube link posted above and I tried to come with a similar idea for my submission maybe a bit more developed... looking for a simpler and more reliable mechanism to drop down the wheels... So, I started with some rough drawings to give a little bit of confidence to myself and I shared these with my brother just for fun. 20 min. latter my brother sent me an email saying -Are you kidding me "thief"....??? I was about to ask him why... but I checked the Youtube links below in his mail... Well, I found that the solution for the drop down wheel seems to be a widely known & trusted way to "flat" a trailer... Additionally It seems that in Youtube you can find all the potential combinations for a drop wheel trailer. So, It would be my honour to submit a model in this challenge but it would be hard to call it innovative... I would not like to put any comments for the already submitted model but it is the truth that many of them have been commercially produced already and might come against to rule 2 (4th Bullet point). However, this observation has nothing to do with my main point that this challenge is harder than it seems... Anyhow I want to thank you for the chance to meet all these new designs that I didn't know before. I will do my best to come with a good idea but I am really afraid that it will not be innovative at all. Good luck to everybody guys and I look forward to see more pioneering ideas
Best Regards
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
Ioannis--I patented a device called a ReadyRamp. It looks like a ladder with hinges (not new), is useful as a truck bed extender (there are several on the market), and folds closed when not in use (big whoop). However, these unremarkable features had never been combined. I sell many, and motorcycle enthusiasts with trucks are happy for the product.
We are dealing with a tool that has probably been around in some form for the last 20,000 years. We are dealing with leverage points and ramp angles, which are probably even older than the wheel. And yet there are some amazing and well thought out designs that have already been submitted.
This contest is for a Catfish trailer with specific traits. I'm already extremely pleased that so many of the designs have been downloaded by the GC community. I don't think anyone will fault you if your trailer looks like a trailer. Thanks for the consideration and for your input.
Ioannis Skarlatakis over 11 years ago
@Cord Please let me thank you for the prompt reply it means a lot. In addition I appreciate your tolerances regarding design as we have to deal with a really old tool. Again don't get me wrong as It wasn't my intention to say anything for any of the submissions. In fact I admire the effort of every single user as I never had the chance to design any similar product and that means no much of experience on this field.
Cheers! ;)
Lumas over 11 years ago
I don't wanna seem like I'm just in this for the monkey, but I reckon I'd feel a little happier about spending long hours on this project if there was a higher chance of more than a t-shirt at the end of it. I.e. Maybe cash prizes for second and third places too. Even if it means splitting the first place prize (maybe $1250 - $750 -$500) between the winners.
Just a thought though, and I'll still be uploading either way :)
Simonr over 11 years ago
I've always wanted a Monkey! ;-)
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
@Luke--consider another viewpoint. With 15 days to go in the competition, there have been 580 downloads of the various entries. For me, I would say THANK YOU to GrabCAD and a BIG THANK YOU to all those who have entered. :)
Lumas over 11 years ago
@Cord: I'd totally agree... I'm sorry, I think I may have phrased my comment badly... My only point was that it's nice for contestants to have a higher chance of being rewarded monetarily for their many hours of work time. Your first place reward is amazing, and I'm not suggesting you need to add more to the overall payout, I just thought that it could be split between the top three entries.
Don't get me wrong though, just entering the competition really is reward enough. I've learned so much (software skills, mechanical, thought processes, etc.) through signing up to many of these GrabCad competitions - and this one has really got me thinking. But, it is nice to have a higher chance of getting something else your of your efforts also :)
I may well be alone in this thinking, but figured it might be worth voicing it. And like I say, I'll still happily be entering my concept whatever happens.
@Simonr: Nothin' like a monkey! Especially the cash kind :)
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
Nine days to go, 48 entries and over 840 downloads...that to me is a successful challenge. The range of solutions, from simple to extremely complex, will doubtless find their way onto actual trailers all over the world. As one of the judges in the contest, I'm looking forward to seeing how the nine private entries compare to what is now on the GrabCAD site. Again, thanks to all who have put their time and ingenuity into this contest, as sharing your efforts with this community is one of the major reasons why GrabCAD is such a robust and popular site.
Alain Di Zeo over 11 years ago
Cord, are we required/recommended to run strength analyses for our design for weight optimization or is the judging criteria purely on the solution for the trailer from a CAD/kinematic perspective?
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
An ingenious trailer with the stated functionality is the main goal. If the kinematics and dimensions are correct but materials have not been called out, standard trailer materials and manufacturing processes will be applied.
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
@Marco--the wheelbase is 2265mm, and the weight distribution is nearly 50:50. The Catfish slightly favors the front.
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
@Marco...you've got a point, as the Miata on which this car is based uses a weight bias including driver. The last scale weight of the car (in lbs) is LF 460 RF 440 LR 310 RR 330 (1,540lbs total).
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
Approximately 300lbs, + 75lbs for the transmission. Weights differ by year and whether A/C, Power Steering, turbo or other items are added/deleted.
thinkin3D over 11 years ago
will we get to see the private entries after the deadline?
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
None of the judges have yet seen the private entries, and I assume they will remain private unless the designer chooses to make their design public. We intend to make at least one trailer, based on the winning design.
thinkin3D over 11 years ago
So if a private entry is chosen, and remains private, we may never get to see it? Bummer
Sara Sigel over 11 years ago
@Cord and @thinkin3d Private entries will switch to public at the deadline per Challenge Rules. So have no fear, you'll get a look at them!
Alain Di Zeo over 11 years ago
Is the swithc from private to public automatic or do I have to go in and make the switch myself?
Sara Sigel over 11 years ago
@Alain I'll take care of it for you.
Alain Di Zeo over 11 years ago
Cord, this may sound a little silly but will sending renderings give me an edge in the judging? Or are you only interested in the functionality with no regard to asthetics (shiny metallics as opposed to default CAD colors)? Thanks.
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
Alain, I'll be judging this with six other people, at least five of which have intimate personal knowledge of what works and what doesn't work for a standard trailer. I'm sure we'll be judging on function more than form, although I can't say that form doesn't count. A light, functional design that is strong and checks all the boxes, and that we can actually build, will be the winner. I'm looking forward to working with the GrabCAD Workbench to review all the designs.
thinkin3D over 11 years ago
@ Alain, I would be happy to do some renderings for you to help out
Alain Di Zeo over 11 years ago
thinkin3d, sure with one VERY important condition. Please do not modify any part of the mechanism or any parts. I have an idea of how to do rendering, but it takes a while on my computer. May try to make one tonight. Once again thank you.
Alain Di Zeo over 11 years ago
Thinkin3d, I hope that you helping me make renderings doesn't impede your chances of winning haha. That would not be fair.
Daniele Grandi over 11 years ago
Could you guys be more specific with the deadline? Thanks!
Mohammad over 11 years ago
Hi :
how can i make my design private ???
Mohammad over 11 years ago
God damn it it was suppose to be private !!!!
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
Home Stretch! I'm really excited about the challenges put forth, from general concepts to projects that are ready to be cut and assembled. This is a modern race car trailer that also solves a 10,000 year old question relating to simplicity, ease of use, balance, utility and use of materials. How could any mechanically-minded person not find this challenge extremely interesting?!
Russell White over 11 years ago
@Cord Bauer - I totally agree! Very exciting challenge! This has definitely inspired my creative and design abilities and I look forward to future challenges! Thank you for the opportunity to compete!
Russell White over 11 years ago
@Cord - I have revised my assembly to reflect the correct position of the wheel spindles. How do I update my entry on GrabCAD? Thanks
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
Russell--I think that you can simply submit a revised drawing, as was done a couple of times with thinkin3d, etceteras. I'm still learning GrabCAD myself...
Russell White over 11 years ago
Cord - Yes sir, you were right. Just opened up the existing file and uploaded the revised frame and assembly. Thank you!
Simonr over 11 years ago
There are some great ideas included in the designs uploaded! It's a shame there is only one prize as there are several I would choose - and it's going to be a hard choice as there is no one which encompases all the best ideas!
Donald Wilson over 11 years ago
Simonr, I agree with you. There are some excellent designs here, and I would hate to be one of the judges.
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
Simonr...I'd be giving this prize out to the top ten designs if I had enough money in my piggy bank. :) And yes, the judging process won't be easy. However, the people who will be looking at these designs all have practical experience either with trailers, with design, fabrication, suspension design and kinematics. Most of the judges have experience with all of the above! We'll need to review all the designs and compare notes carefully before declaring a winner. Also, the SEMA show is next month, which means that we are also preparing our car for Las Vegas. The SEMA Catfish is now sitting with a bare frame on our nondescript trailer. It's getting ready for a new wiring harness, interior and freshly painted bodywork.
Simonr over 11 years ago
Cord - the prize is very generous, particularly considering the background to you running this challenge. I doubt anyone would want you to put up more money - but it makes the decision harder than ever, for which I don't envy the judges. Have a good time at SEMA. A group of my friends are traveling from the UK to visit - I wish I had the time to join them!
steven Stracner over 11 years ago
i like how in the rules it states "By entering this competition, you 1. Warrant that the work is your original work. 2. To the best of your knowledge, it is not, and has not been in production or otherwise previously published or exhibited." but ive read alot of descriptions about how they found their ideas on youtube and google...come on guys this is an engineering website not copy and POST lol
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
Thanks again to everyone who entered, and thanks to those who understand that this will not be an easy competition to judge. I'm very lucky to have other judges with engineering and manufacturing backgrounds who can help sort out all of the designs. This competition represents well over 1,000 hours of collective work on these designs, and we will make every effort to sort out the substance from the style, and separate those ideas that are being sold now from those ideas that are just crazy enough to work. However, we can't sacrifice safety or utility simply for a novel idea...the trailer must work safely and perform the functions listed. Last, we'll be using the full amount of time required to come up with our list of finalists and the winner. GrabCAD will receive winners later this month, and should be able to notify everyone of the winner in early November. Thank you again for a really exciting challenge with some novel concepts and designs.
DWP over 11 years ago
@steven stracner I confess, my entire design is based on this principle (skip to 1:03 to save time):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=7rCvfOAxiMk#t=65
Now, please show me the copy/POST part, but please don't mention the wheels, my trailer is the only one on this planet using wheels. Not sure about the Panhard rod, I've heard that there is one more somewhere, in Jamaica...or Poland, I guess.
steven Stracner over 11 years ago
im not trying to step on anybody's toes, most great inventions are combining or refining already made things. this message was to everybody, not to single out anybody, to try to keep it as original as possible for competition's sake and don't say "i got this idea from...". the trailers cotton farmers use would fit this comp great bc they are successful and have been for a very long time but that just takes the fun out of it for me.i wasnt trying to offend you. but this is a cash prize and i just want the winner to be original
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
The Industrial Designer in our group and the designer of the Catfish--Shawn Whetstone--has sent me his comments from the competition. They're below:
Trailer challenge comments from Shawn Whetstone (Industrial Designer)
MARCO TULIO MIRANDA ARAUJO
If the number one criteria for this competition was to come up with an "outside the box" idea; then this concept gets my 1st place vote. Flat pack low cost shipping, DYI assembly, provides multiple use scenarios, a trailer, a lift, and a great way to work on the car! While the design may need a bit of refinement, simplification, and compromise to find its way into production, the philosophy is excellent! I like the utilitarian visual of the extruded aluminum chassis with a touch of surfacing edginess in the wheel fenders. Lastly, great job surfacing the Catfish.
Arun James
This trailer has simplicity and style! With a slight modification to the cross braces the beautiful sides could become a structural space frame style truss.
Germone Provost
The deployable travel covers that nest inside the "Daytona Charger rear wing" is a unique and intriguing design statement! Also, the Arched rail that the cover rides on is a nice visual.
Thinkin 3d
The black one just plain looks good, and has an impressive amount of realistic detailing! I will let our engineering judges debate the merits of the cam mechanism.
Vladimir Palffy
This concept puts a smile on my face.
6CO DESIGN
A minimalist, lightweight, collapsible, space frame trailer; Beautiful! May be challenging to execute but I like the design philosophy.
Kashim Yeh
Simple clever design.
Sara Sigel over 11 years ago
Congratulations to all the winners!!!
thinkin3D over 11 years ago
Thank you for such a wonderful opportunity to design a product, help others and earn some extra cash. As a single father of 5, it will be put to good use. I would like to thank everyone who posted comments, and supported the project. I would also like to congratulate all of the participants and their extraordinary projects. Thank you so very much!
-Pat
Tommy Mueller over 11 years ago
Superb finish to all, special congrats to thinkin3D
Great challenge to follow everyone :)
Lumas over 11 years ago
Congrats to all the winners, and a big one to https://grabcad.com/thinkin3d-v. Your design, and the level of detail you took it to, is real inspiration. The win is really well deserved.
A special thanks to Cord and the team also for putting together a super fun, well thought-out competition. The level of involvement you took in addressing questions and concerns is really appreciated (many other competition sponsors should take note (*cough cough* GE *cough cough*)).
Again, a great job to everyone who took part.
Stephen Nyberg over 11 years ago
Cangratulations everyone. Job well done!!!
Tomas over 11 years ago
Congratulations to all the winners! Great challenge!
Julius Siador over 11 years ago
One wonderful result from a well-versed competition sponsor! And, congratulations to the winners and a well-deserved first placer. Yet, all of the entries are so interesting that we can now pick and choose ideas for a well-customized trailer. So, congratulations everyone for your ideas: your selfless efforts are endearingly welcome to the GrabCad community. Great thanks to this wholesome challenge. I can now resume developing my unfinished works and incorporate other ideas in this particular challenge as well. Thank you everyone, especially to all competition sponsors and to those who magnanimously contribute their well-thought-of designs to the ever-expanding GrabCad public library.
Donald Wilson over 11 years ago
Congratulations, thinkin3d, you had a great design, and it was a well deserved win.
Thank you, Cord for a great and fun challenge. I am honored and humbled to have placed at all given the fact that I started drafting school in January of this year, and only started 3d modeling in March, and this is the first challenge I have entered.
Thanks again!
Cord Bauer over 11 years ago
This really, really was a tough challenge to judge. The brave conceptual designs needed to be weighed against the purely functional, ready-to-build models. Further, it's extremely hard if not impossible to design a trailer using solutions that haven't been used before. How does that relate to the judging? Not easily. I could spend a happy summer "Frankensteining" trailers together from all of the great ideas that came from this challenge. Thank you again, and congratulations to all who participated.
Julius Siador over 11 years ago
We all understand your situation, Cord. We already knew we are not dealing with one superfactory that has exceptional capacity to test and evaluate all conceptual works in just one sweep no matter how odd or intricate the ideas could be. Naturally, we always lean to what we know that works, especially when we place safety as one of personal priority/criteria in our judging, as the outcome is intended for real-world application. Good luck with your future customized Catfish trailer. Looking forward for another sponsored GrabCad challenge from you ;) And again, many thanks for sponsoring a showcase of GrabCad community's talents.
neil louw over 11 years ago
Wow! I just got home after a week in the African bush and saw the results of this competition. Thanx for the honour of placing in your challenge and congratulations to thinkin3D for the win! Also thanx to all who gave me such glowing praise during the competition. Thank you to GrabCad and the sponsors - I will wear the shirt with pride! Now, bring on the next challenge!:)
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